Allowing yourself to let go.......
You know how sometimes life takes you for a spin and before you know it......BAM! Something new is facing you? I've been there so many times.......and each time I've only wished that I could have a heads up before getting hit by the hurricanes.
Today I had a heads up.
My 13 yr old daughter took me out this evening to talk. Seriously. Her father had called earlier and she talked to him quietly in her room. It's almost like they've got something going on. Or rather......they do have something going on.
So today we talked. She is determined to go live with her father. She explained to me that her father told her that he will sign custody of the children over to me on the agreement that I allow him to take her. Red flags went up, but I let her have her say. She said that she discussed many issues with him, including the way she dresses. He agreed to all her conditions. So what the deal seems to be, is that he will be taking her with him to Egypt as soon as next week. He will get her back in school and buy her way thru the last couple of months. I'm sure he can buy her decent passing marks on her report card as well.
My daughter told me how painful it was leaving without saying goodbyes to everyone. She talked about not feeling like she fits in here in Canada. She said how badly she misses her best friend in Egypt. (she said this many times) And then she told me that she plans to be back in Canada for September so that she can start school. She plans to come back to me. She said that probably starting the school year from the beginning would be easier for her. And she also said that she feels like her place is to live with her sisters and her brother. But that she has to give her Father a chance, even if she'll regret it.
I told her that if that was her reasoning.......I didn't see what the importance of her Egyptian report card was. I told her that she should wait for summer, and then go take a vacation in Egypt, rather than lose her Canadian school year. I also told her that perhaps she could go live with her father here in Canada for the remainder of the school year before leaving. She had excuses for all of it. In all honesty.....what I feel is that she is using her father. (unless she's playing me?) She wants to go to Egypt and return the hero. Reap the Glory of......"I'm standing beside my Dad". And although I can understand her saying that she didn't say a proper goodbye.........she did say goodbye to her friends because I made extra effort towards it.
So what do I do? I believe that I'll have to let her go. And I wonder what her father has been telling her? Does she really believe that he'll let her come back? I addressed as much as I could while we talked.......and then had to bite my tongue not to cry. I need to sleep on this before I go back to talk to her more. And right now.........I'm trying to get up my strength to talk to the Big Bad Wolf. Come to think of it.....it seems like he has something to talk to me about as well..........how he plans on taking his daughter.
~~~~
My daughter also told me some other things. It seems the Hubbex showed her some papers saying that he's divorced MM. I was told that he was preparing those papers but that he wouldn't actually pronounce the divorce on MM until he left. He's telling people otherwise. Whatever. I told my daughter the divorce doesn't matter.
And then..........
She confided another secret. Hubbex is planning to get married while he's in Egypt. He told her that he can't live without a wife. I just don't know how I feel about that. It's final, isn't it? Final is good. But it is also sad. You think he'd let things cool off a bit, don't you? I wonder if he'll call his kids here in Canada and tell them? Or perhaps he'll just do like before and not. When they do find out, my house will blow up. My oldest will be lost to him forever. It's just too soon. I feel like the Hubbex has three words on his forehead.....
Me. Me. Me.
~~~~
I will talk about support first. This is important......and will make the custody obvious. At one point, I will serve him with the custody papers. I plan to ask him what he is going to do about going to Egypt. Will he be going back and forth? Does he want the kids to come visit him in the summers? I wonder what he'll say to me about the 13 yr old? Does he think I'll just hand over her passport?
And here's the biggie...........I'm going to tell him that I want him to write the villa in my name. That I deserve something in Egypt for my years of living alone, for my dedication to our marriage and for building up our life together. He just can't walk away with it all. But how to enforce it? How do I push him on that? Help me think........
Perhaps I'll say the villa and the small apt in the family building. Under the agreement that I won't sell it. I'd like to tell him to write the Mercedes to me as well......but would that be pushing it?
He has so much in Egypt.....and I know that telling him I want the villa will DRIVE HIM NUTS! But I picked it out......and I pushed him for it. He bought it for me......for me and the kids. The thought of him living there with his new wife (whenever he finds her) just makes me mad. That was going to be ours.
I was thinking about telling him that until he's written these things in my name and certified them, that I won't hand over the 13 yr olds passport......but that's just wrong, right? So how do I do it? Give me your advice......
~~~~
And here it is............2 am. Sleep is ignoring me.......I'm in pain. My brain is wired and I just wonder how this will play out. I grieve, friends. Yes, that's what it is.......I grieve.
I
just
want
to
cry.
posted by Safa at 10:41 PM
26 Comments:
Safa!! allow yourself the comfort of tears. just let that out of your system.
You need the strength to deal with your daughter and your husband.
I honestly dont know what to say about her going to live with your husband. I think he is being rather selfish and awful not considering for one minute the needs of the daughter. its all ME ME ME, like you said.
MY GOD! I keep thinking when I read what you write about what he discusses with her...she is just a CHILD, a little girl!!
sweetie you are in my prayers..
11:31 PM
I don't think he will sign anything over to you...so instead of demanding that, demand he writes the villa and the apartment to the children. Better, make that clear to your children, and have them demand it from him.
If he says no to that, he is denying what is rightfully theirs, and that will look REALLY bad for him.
When this happened in my family, my sister (law student, by the way) and i not only demanded that property acquired during both my mom's and her mom's marriage to our father be written to us, but also we "supervised" his new marriage contract (to wife no.3).
Believe me, it has made all the difference.
12:50 AM
I don't have a blog but I still have thoughts :). Strategy time Safa so here are some masculine words of wisdom.
1. Don't let any of your children go to Egypt without your direct supervision period. I.E. You take them you are provided for by him with complete roundtrip ticket for the whole stay. You maintain positive control of the passports and then you leave with them All in a nice little bundle. The 13 year old will get over it. Honestly she will be ok. She's a child and they are rather resilient. I didn't think so at first but it seems that is the case. It hurts, but eventually you and they get over it. This is one of those Allah lesson things and unless you want to wait until your daughter is 35 to see her again I suggest you listen to the short lesson. If she really wants to go let her decide at 16, but definitely not now. When she goes though she will not be coming back. Looking at his past track record I can bank on that.
2. I know it hurts but any assets from Egypt are memories. Let them go trying to hold on to anything over there will only entangle you in a sea of negativity. Just ask for comparable living arrangements here and call it good. Get the properties appraised if there is such a thing and then ask for half/ all of that.
3. The only reason you haven't served him the paperwork yet is there is a tiny voice in the back of your head saying that this is the final thread, and serving him those papers will make everything a reality and the truth is way deep down you still love him and divorce sucks, but it is a decision that can't be avoided. (love those run-on sentences man) I would say make it easy on yourself and pay a courier service to do it or a sheriff's deputy or something then it is out of your hands and you are not responsible for the procrastination thereof. You however have to ask the question is this it? Am I ready to move on? If the answer is yes stop farting around and serve the papers. If you want another year of mind games hold on to them. It is really that simple.
I'm glad to see things going so well for you SafaMa. You have come a long way and your progress is really heartwarming and seeing the blessings of Allah unfold before my eyes is very encouraging.
We are going to make it, Insha Allah it has been rough but we are going to make it Alhamdulillah.
2:06 AM
More Strategy big red flag!!!
How long if you lose your child's paperwork does it take to get new ones there in Canada? How long has hubbex been there? He's the biological father, he theoretically has access to everything. OH I lost my daughters paperwork can I get a duplicate copy? Think about it THINK REAL HARD!!
Thinking like a Man, cause women don't.
Peace Safa
2:36 AM
I'm having a bad gut feeling about all this........as I've said before those feelings are rarely wrong.
That man has some serious mental problems that he thinks it's okay to split the family up and to "confide" in a 13 yr old.
I agree with what Muhammad said, she will get over it if you don't let her go. She needs to realize she's the child here and you are the custodial parent. I would make sure you mention to whomever is helping you with the legal end of things that you are afraid he might take one or more of the children and leave the country, that he's a flight risk.
I'm saying many prayers that this resolves in your favor! Stand your ground!
6:17 AM
Oh this has been good to read....thanks for stopping by, Muhammad.
About the paperwork....yes, hubbex can get birth certificates and other things.....but he can't get a passport. Both parents have to apply for that.....in person.
Serving the papers: A courier was supposed to do it. But in the end, I told the lawyer to give them to me cuz I'm seeing Hubbex. We don't have a straight address on him, so the courier option was difficult. Not to mention that Hubbex lives in a city an hour's drive away......
Comparable living arrangements......I like that. I also like the idea of having things written in the kids names.......
Cindi.....I know she'll get over things........but with this daughter......she'll make sure to make everyone's life miserable in the meantime......what to do? In court the judge would ask a 12 yr old where she wants to go.......
8:41 AM
I was in a sort-of similar predicament when i was 13. my parents had been divorced for years, my dad had been dating the same woman for a long time (my now step-mom) and my mom had just started a serious relationship. i didn't accept the man that made my mom happy. i was always closer to my dad even tho i lived with my mom up until then. years later, i found out my dad tried to get back together with my mom . she said no. he started taking advantage of the fact i wasn't getting along with my mom. we would have the long private talks, he'd 'confide' in me about the problems he'd had with my mom, etc. very much like what your hubbex is doing. but to lesser extreme. anyway.. i ended up leaving and going with my dad. my mom did not put up a fight.
now my dad had promised me the moon and starts if i went to live with him. all the advantages, etc. and he delivered for the first few months. then everything changed - he married and we went to live with his wife and her kids. a lot of pressure was put on me to be the eldest child of the family.. when i was still trying to adjust to the changes that had been made. for a long, i was angry with my mom for not fighting for me.
my father's parenting skills, at least with me.. were very loose and carefree (wanting to be the 'good cop) and i got myself into a lot of trouble trying to do things to get his attention as a teen.
you have to fight for your daughter, safa. period.
you fought to get out of egypt.. you fought to get where you are.. and even if she makes your life a living hell for the next few years... in the end insha allah you won't have any regrets.
dads like these are in it to 'stick it' to their ex-wives. they will promise their daughters everything when in the end she will only be disappointed. and may even blame you.
today i get along with my dad but i learned a lot from my experiences growing up. i don't hold anything against him and we all get along (mom, dad, stepmom).
10:49 AM
oh yeah - and i remember the night my dad came to take me from my mom. he told me "if she wants you to come back, she will come get you."
yeah.. those words stuck with me. i used to think my mom was glad to get rid of me.
10:51 AM
I am so sorry that you are going through this.
My only advice: PLEASE DO NOT GIVE OVER HER PASSPORT. As it has been put to me, girls in countries like this do not leave without their father's permission. Would you really want the 13 year old to get there, realize that it is not worth it, and be stuck against her will just so that Hubbex can "show you who's in charge?"
10:52 AM
Don't do anything that is not sanctioned by Canadian law. I would not let her go until you have official paperwork drawn up. You are also entitled to things like the villa and the car. For God's sake, Safa, your full time job has been running a household for how many years??? I'd get a lawyer and have this all drawn up-everything you want: custody, visitation rights, property, alimony, child support....everything. Get it in writing. I'm w/ Cindi: Something is not right about this.
12:58 PM
Your girl should not be anywhere where you are not. Period. She is young, impressionable and her physical safety is to be considered.
Have you come straight out and told her it is extremely possible that she will not be allowed to come back and that she will not have contact with you? Some children can deal with this information and see the path. Can she deal with the real possibility of this happening? Explain to her that his marriage to another woman will allow him to harden his stance towards not letting her leave.
She will get over the anger eventually. Whether she will get over her cirsumstances completely is to be seen and possibly unlikely. After all you have all been living in extraordinary circumstances. The scars will remain. But better the scars than to lose her completely.
The papers should be delivered by a third party. That is the norm. NOT BY YOU.
Ask for whatever you want, but dont hold your breath. Ask because you never gain anything by not asking. But most likely things are not going to be written over to you. But stand firm on the child support. Do not budge on that. Have you been in touch with a good attorney in Egypt. Now may be the time to do your research, if you have to get an accounting of his property to ensure child support.
It is custody, custody and custody first. Support next, Divorce third.
Buzz me on messenger tonight if you want to bounce ideas off. Called you but no one answered.
Sadiyah
4:13 PM
Oh Safa, you are all in my thoughts and prayers. Please thing long and hard. I too have a really bad feeling about this.
4:16 PM
Remember how much trouble it was for you to get her out of Egypt the first time. Next time he will be expecting it.
He is not trustworthy, does not keep his word. . .this is your daughter's future, can you trust him--in his current self-centered state--with it?
4:50 PM
Sister,
I am sure even if you have Legal paper work for her or any of the kids in Canada, it will not mean anything in Egypt.
Dont let her go. I remember my father was super nice with me when he was trying to show is girlfriend, who wanted kids how wonderful he was to his daughter, my other sisters were grown already. But this woman was smart, and did not marry him. After they brokeup i hardly saw my father. Later i found out what ti was all about.
This story is just to show you how there men will use their kids.
Good luck
5:55 PM
Wow salma that must have hurt. How insane.
Safa...I feel like you got the guy cornered. And now this is his way to get you back, where it will hurt. To take his daughter away.
Since when did he start caring about her so much? Why didn't he offer to have her come live w/ him before for all those years. Sure she was young but what about last year. This year she's still young just like last year. So why didnt he think of this last year.
Why is it NOW?
I say you put your foot down w/ your daughter. It'll hurt but I do think the feeling of having your mom fight for you is something significant.
Make sure you tell her straight out to think about if she can never come back or if she is not able to at least see you for a long time?
Don't let her become a pawn he uses against you. Like what if he calls you and says..'im gona marry her off to x, y and z and yur not allowed to talk to her' and so you can't verify anything. and what if he says ok if u want her back, bring all the kids back to egypt etc etc.
This guy has shown that he's not trustworthy. I mean in the middle of all this HODGE PODGE, the idiot is thinking about getting married RITE NOW AGAIN? What about all his lovely promises to his daughter? His daughter isn't going to be the apple of his eye realistically speaking once the wife or if the wife enters the scene. Wives need time. Thats a reality of life.
So I think sure give your daughter time to think bla bla..but let her know that the final decision RESTS WITH YOU.
She will get over it Safa but this man could pull some CRAAAZY stunt on you that you haven't even thought of. Don't be naive w/ him or try to be too nice. At this point, your first priority is safety for yourself and your kids.
And why is it that oh all of a sudden he has to go back to egypt and settle there. What about all those damn years he couldnt go back? Why can't he stick around now and be near his other kids?
Doesn't he care about his other kids? Why hasn't he asked to take them w/ him? Think bout the kind of effect this will have on the others, it'll solidify for them that he cares about her and not them.
Sometimes there's that one kid who can't see the forest for the trees. She may make life hell but at least she'll be safe.
But u know what on second thought..if she does make life hell..let her go..in the summer. But at least this way she'll know you wanted her. That's important Safa.
Girls need their fathers. and i think thats what this girl is yearning for. But the father has to be sane and responsible and caring. Something this man has shown time and time again that he's stopped being..at least towards you and the kids.
oh yeh he really wants you back. Why doesn't he take you back now and come start living with you or make the offer? Why is it that you have to pack up and go back to egypt?
you do sound like its hurting to make it final(the divorce) but the track record just can't be ignored at this point. and you know that more than us commentors. But safa..it is sad. and it is ok to cry. and ask Allah to replace you with something better. You never know what he has in store for you Safa. You never know.
Look how far yuv come...Don't let this man get you in some weird twisted trap now. He knows he can pull your heart strings with your kids. That's all he's got on you now.
I don't know what you ever did to him for him to treat you like this. But may Allah show him the error of his ways. ameen.
6:52 PM
may Allah grant you jannah Safa.
may Allah grant you jannah for your patience n all yuv been through.
Remember the hadith that says that Allah will dip the person in jannah and ask him if he's seen any hardship in life.a.nd they'll say no..or do i have it backward..but u proly know which one im refering to.
Its better to have a stinky sofa out of your living room. And to have a clean nice space that is empty, and roomy but at least its clean and inviting. Versus the stinky sofa was there..but it stunk up the room..and you couldnt sit on it. so it was useless. but hey u got used to the sofa being there so throwing it out is hard.
weird analogy heh.
6:57 PM
As Salaamu Alaikum Sister Safa:
Alhamdulillah, Brother Muhammad has given you the best advice.
Love and hugz dear ... I know it is not easy.
MaSalaama
Safiyyah
7:16 PM
PS Safa:
The stuff he's pulling with your sweet child is called "emotional incest" by some psychologists!
7:21 PM
I agree with whoever mentioned that it doesn't matter what kind of paperwork you have in Canada, it will not make one spot of difference in Egypt. Don't let her go. The court may ask her what she wants, but judges are not so narrow minded that they cannot see the whole picture and what is best for the child. How do you think he will look in court? He will look like a schmuck! He was living it up with one wife, then another, while the rest of you were all alone in Egpyt, then he divorced one, is apparently divorcing the second now, and now needs another just like that and all of a sudden is ready to go back to Egpyt and wants just one of his children to go back and separate from the rest and the only parent that has been there all along??? I think that any judge in the entire north america who would let that happen is completely insane, no matter who the child says she wants to live with. I'm sure they are very aware of international issues. Hold your ground.
9:28 PM
I was at the US Embassy in Cairo the other day, there was this girl there trying to get her daughter back. Her and her daughter were both US citizens but the father is Egyptian. Anyhow, The girl isn't with the father of her child anymore, but she said they came to Egypt to try and work things out. She said that time went by and things just didn't work out at all. So she bought her and her daughter (5 years old) a ticket back. She said her daughter and her was about to board the plane and then all of a sudden these police officers came running up to her and detained her and the baby. Apparently they had lived in Egypt before and he had convinced her to come back to Egypt (to give it one more try). This was his trap, once they came, he went and got a court order and now neither one of them can leave right now. The US Embassy told her that they could get her out but they would have a hard time and long fight to be able to get the child out.
I felt so sorry for her. Anyhow, just thought I would share that story.
4:15 AM
Please don't let her go. Don't even entertain the idea with her. Let her know it's not an option.
He has found the "weakest" link and proceeded to attempt to brainwash her. If it wasn't her, it would be one of the others, which he probably, if the truth be known, tried this with all of them.
She is not old or wise enough to make this decision for herself. He is also not competent to make this decision. He's come up a day late and a dollar short, huh?
You fought long and hard to get those kids (whose father was never around) safely out of Egypt. Stick to your guns.
4:19 AM
egypt is not a party to hague(Sp?) convention and neither is most of the "muslim" world. This means that they DO NOT accept/follow/enforce child custody agreements from other countries. Read up on it safa.
Also, there is something in the US that I mentioned to ORAU that they may have in canada that could be helpful. It is an alert system that notifies a parent or attorney when and if anyone in the world tries to obtain a passport for a child. Even in the US you can obtain a passport without the other parent's permission if you can provide a good enough reason. In the US you can also get a passport with a notarized signature of the non applying parent if they cannot be there. If you know someone it can be easy.
Just be careful safa...
4:47 AM
For God's sake listen to all these people! We can't all be wrong! Also, you've said she gets teary and such when she thinks about leaving---ask her how would she feel if she's never allowed to talk to any of you or see you again.....that is what this jerk will do. He lost his rights as a parent when he started all his b.s. so fight to maintain FULL custody and that he can only see them in Canada since Egyptian law can't enforce a Canadian court ruling.
10:12 AM
Oh yes, about the paperwork delivered by you.......as long as you won't need proof it was served to him don't do it yourself. Have someone else do it who can then be a witness that he received it.
10:16 AM
ive been staying away from blogs for a while, but i had to comment on this one.
i agree with everyone. do not let this girl go!! she thinks her world will end if she doesnt, but she will get over it and her world will not end.
think of the future if you let her go. think of how long she lived without her dad in egypt. did he care so much to be with her when all of you were begging him to come back to egypt and give all of you your rights?
no no and no.
im not saying he doesnt love her but all of this "sudden" need to live with his daughter is b.s. he is trying to hang on with whatever he can.
you worked like hell to get all of you out safe and sound. you worked even harder in canada to get them what they need....not even what they want...what they need. and he didnt give a damn then either. he emptied the account!!
if she goes, you will not get her back. this will be his payback to you for leaving him!! his way of showing you!!
she may hate you for a while for not letting her go back....and she will make everyones life miserable but youll all survive!!
why not, also, is he so keen on living in egypt again. he wasnt interested for the past few years.
so let him suffer on his own.
7:31 PM
"Starting BS" does not result in loss of parental rights in Islam. As Muslims, we must remember Allah (swt) in all of our afairs. But Safa needs to resolve this in a wise manner.
6:28 AM
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